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ModTown 2015 => Modder Claims => Topic started by: HybridDisorder on July 27, 2015, 12:15:42 AM

Title: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: HybridDisorder on July 27, 2015, 12:15:42 AM
I would like put a small underwater entrance to something in the lake just north of the city. I have attached a map with a circle around the rock my entrance will be nearby.

Architectural Style: Dwemer, caves, probably several others.



Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Darkelfguy on July 27, 2015, 12:26:22 AM
Sounds good, the lake could definitely use an underwater ruin or secret entrance of some sort.

Good luck, and happy modding! :)
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: HybridDisorder on July 28, 2015, 06:19:38 PM
I've made a lot of progress. The main structure of the dungeon is all laid out, I just need to spend a lot of time detailing now before I add some mobs. This is turning out quite a bit bigger than I anticipated.

Attached is a teaser screenshot of an unfinished waterfall.

Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Darkelfguy on July 29, 2015, 02:07:23 PM
Looks really good so far! Is that all one massive cavern surrounding the waterfall? Must be a pretty large dungeon to fit all of that in there.
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: HybridDisorder on July 29, 2015, 03:26:11 PM
Looks really good so far! Is that all one massive cavern surrounding the waterfall? Must be a pretty large dungeon to fit all of that in there.

The cave is huge but that's largely for scenic reasons. I'm trying to keep the actual dungeon path a reasonable length so there's not too much walking.

Overall progress:
First Cavern Statics 95%
Second Cavern Statics 45-50%
Mobs, loot, etc 0%

I've attached a nice shot of the first area of the dungeon, along with an updated waterfall picture from a new angle...


Edit: For reference, the tree in the foreground of the first picture is at the top of the tower and the waterfall is at the bottom. This is contained within the Akulakhan chamber so that might give you some kind of idea for scale.
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Moritius on July 29, 2015, 03:48:15 PM
It's amazing, remembers me Myst, somehow.
(Probably) the first place I'm planning to explore when mod will be finished :D.
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Melchior Dahrk on July 29, 2015, 04:28:57 PM
This looks freaking awesome! Can't wait to explore it.
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: HybridDisorder on July 29, 2015, 05:32:07 PM
It's amazing, remembers me Myst, somehow.
(Probably) the first place I'm planning to explore when mod will be finished :D.

This looks freaking awesome! Can't wait to explore it.

Thank you both very much!! I'm going to take time and try to really polish this mod, especially because this is my first public work (and biggest project). I'll keep the thread updated with pictures as I go.

I'm trying to figure out how difficult it should be. On one hand, I am a big fan of no level scaling with mobs for a lot of reasons. On the other hand, I want everyone to be able to explore what I'm creating. Also if I have higher level mobs, I feel better about leaving a glass dagger lying around somewhere. How do people feel about this?
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Darkelfguy on July 29, 2015, 07:40:08 PM
Usually I go with mobs that are of middling level, between levels 10~15, with the occasional boss in the lower level 20s spectrum. Most player characters can handle mobs at around that level, and the occasional boss will keep it from being too easy.

As for loot, you can actually take the Bethesda approach with valuable items and just hide them. Bethesda did this all of the time in vanilla Morrowind, where valuable items weren't really protected by tough mobs so much as they were hidden on a ledge just out of reach, or behind a chest, or in a tree stump. There's plenty of good hiding places in dungeons, and it gives an extra incentive and reward for players to fully explore the dungeons they're delving in.

But anyway, love the new screens, you're doing some seriously awesome work with your dungeon so far! :)
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: HybridDisorder on August 02, 2015, 06:41:51 PM
Usually I go with mobs that are of middling level, between levels 10~15, with the occasional boss in the lower level 20s spectrum. Most player characters can handle mobs at around that level, and the occasional boss will keep it from being too easy.

As for loot, you can actually take the Bethesda approach with valuable items and just hide them. Bethesda did this all of the time in vanilla Morrowind, where valuable items weren't really protected by tough mobs so much as they were hidden on a ledge just out of reach, or behind a chest, or in a tree stump. There's plenty of good hiding places in dungeons, and it gives an extra incentive and reward for players to fully explore the dungeons they're delving in.

But anyway, love the new screens, you're doing some seriously awesome work with your dungeon so far! :)

Thank you! I'll probably stick to mobs around those levels then. At least for the "main" bosses  ;)

So I recruited my brother to help me with polishing this dungeon up and he's added some very, very cool stuff. He's way better at lava caves than I am.

Attached are a few new screenshots, but I don't know how many more spots I can take screenshots of without spoiling some cool stuff.
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Drakkmore on August 02, 2015, 06:47:15 PM
Looks great, I am definitely putting that on my list of "go here first" places
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: HybridDisorder on August 02, 2015, 07:05:58 PM
Looks great, I am definitely putting that on my list of "go here first" places

Thank you very much!

Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: HybridDisorder on August 12, 2015, 02:16:56 PM
Update:

I haven't had as much time lately due to moving and work, but I have been getting in small stuff that's adding up.

I'd say the statics are about 95% done for the entire dungeon now. It's ended up being a lot more explorable then originally intended, so there's a lot of little areas I need to figure out what to do with. I guess I might up with more "mini-bosses" than I thought :D

Enemies 0%
Loot 0%
Story 50%

No screenshots this time because the areas I've been working on I don't want to spoil.
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Darkelfguy on August 13, 2015, 05:49:28 PM
Good to hear you're still working on this, looking forward to seeing more of your dungeon, the screenshots thus far have been fantastic! :)
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Wretched Fetcher on August 29, 2015, 03:14:05 AM
This is truly a very beautiful dungeon.
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: HybridDisorder on September 03, 2015, 12:40:26 PM
Quick update:

Things are still progressing, albeit slowly. I just moved and my semester just stared at the same time, so the amount of free time I have is small. I have the statics at about 98-99% finished, I'm just adding polish and such. After the statics are finally done I'm going to move on to mob placement, then after that loot stuff.

When is the deadline for this?
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Darkelfguy on September 13, 2015, 05:30:57 PM
Great to hear you're still working on this, the deadline is round about December for this so you have plenty of time!
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: HybridDisorder on September 13, 2015, 09:35:02 PM
Great to hear you're still working on this, the deadline is round about December for this so you have plenty of time!

Oh good! BTW I just watched your youtube modtown update, everything is looking really nice.
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: HybridDisorder on November 27, 2015, 04:42:06 PM
Hello,

Things are still progressing. I would say I'm 90% completed with the project. Statics are all done; the remaining 10% is polish, loot, and enemies. It seems like every time I do a run through I find another small thing to fix or add.

I've been thinking about adding one more smallish area but it depends on how the rest of the dungeon pans out.

I want to add modders resources for some custom weapons and a custom boss. Is there a specific folder I should be putting meshes, icons, and textures in? Some sort of Modtown specific subfolder? Or can I put them anywhere?

Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Autoclock on November 27, 2015, 06:15:20 PM
For now, just package everything into a folder marked something along the lines of "HD_MT2015", to separate it from what others are going to add to the data files when the whole thing is done.

What kind of file size we talking here for your resources?
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: HybridDisorder on November 27, 2015, 10:24:23 PM
All of the resources together are 6.97 MB. They are all modders resources I found on MW Modding history. Should I post the sources here or include them in a text file with the final version?

Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Autoclock on November 27, 2015, 10:25:59 PM
Safest bet is probably to do both.
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Darkelfguy on November 28, 2015, 09:54:20 AM
Aye, I'd recommend both as well, it'll help us keep track of all the files. Any great to hear you're making good progress on this! :)
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Autoclock on December 26, 2015, 02:08:30 PM
Really impressed with how this claim looked in the recent video. Anyone can pick a giant cave piece, set some statics in it, and leave me thoroughly underwhelmed, but not everyone can deliver such a pleasant sight at such a scale. Very well done.

The flora-filled cavern felt like some piece of a rainforest fell into a crevice and spared from being mowed down by giant Dwemer siege machines or something, which is really cool.
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Melchior Dahrk on December 27, 2015, 01:45:39 AM
I agree with Autoclock. I'd only want to echo what Darkelfguy alluded to in the video which is: give thought to mobility within your claim - at least for areas where everyone should be able to reach.
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Autoclock on December 27, 2015, 10:08:31 AM
True, though I think sometimes we forget that Levitation is a thing, and there's only so much you can do to prevent it from making things too easy, especially when it would be great to flat-out require it, which I'm a fan of, because for unconventional level design, the player's ability to traverse the area is a pain in the ass, unless you embrace one of my rules: You can fly in this game, so DO IT!
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: HybridDisorder on January 28, 2016, 10:56:06 AM
Back again! Life is busy, but I've done too much already to not make this as cool as I can.

I'm getting together the complete modders resource list, just coordinating a few things with my brother about some more waterfalls. He's better at that bit than I am :D Plus I decided that what was going to be the final boss is actually a mini boss and I've added two additional rooms that are pretty bare bones right now.

Thank you guys for the kind words! I'm really trying to make this dungeon very detailed and put lots of little treasure caches.

As far as levitation goes, I'm designing the dungeon with that in mind but the primary path is a foot path. A character can complete the dungeon with or without levitation, though if they choose to levitate they might spoil some of the cool location reveals I'm trying to have. Anyone ever play Dark Souls? You know how the levels will often loop back and show you where you were in a scenic manner, or you'll get a small glimpse of where you'll end up later? That's what I'm trying to do with the foot path. I'm also "gating" the progression as much as I can unless certain keys are found, but this being MW of course you could use an unlock spell then dispel yourself of the curse from the door.

If you can levitate you might be able to find a few extra hidden treasures but for the most part everything is reachable on foot. There is one small exception to this design idea, but the player should pick up an item they need to get to the area on the foot path if they can't levitate.

I had a question about something in the CS. So I've accidentally clicked on one of the Tel Fyr interior cells names before, didn't modify anything, but now it has a * next to the cell name like my modded cells do. I think I accidentally did the same thing with the exterior cell containing Vivec's Palace. Is this an issue? If so can I fix it?
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Melchior Dahrk on January 28, 2016, 12:23:58 PM
Keep in mind that you can disable levitation if it really breaks your area. I think it should be used sparingly since Morrowind is all about freedom. But, for instance, I had to use it in Dippy Dorugg's to avoid cheating (you can look at the script on the red activator under the black in_lava_blacksquare meshes there).

ALSO note that you can make locks that cannot be picked if that would really mess with your claim. There are several ways that you could accomplish that - there's a desk in the Fort Frostmoth Imperial Shrine area which was the first time I encountered a script like that.

To answer your question: yes, it is an issue as it will make the mod "dirty". Which means that if a mod that ACTUALLY makes legitimate modifications to those cells is loaded before your mod, then your illegitimate changes will overwrite the real mod. There are a number of ways to fix this. My personal favorite if I know I accidentally made a dirty edit is to load it up in TESAME (http://wiki.theassimilationlab.com/mmw/TESAME) and remove those changes manually. As a best practice, you should clean all of your ESPs with tes3cmd (http://wiki.theassimilationlab.com/mmw/TES3cmd) before uploading them anywhere.

I hope that helps. Fire away if you have any other questions though.
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: HybridDisorder on January 28, 2016, 12:56:11 PM
Thank you Melchior for the advice. I will make sure there are no dirty edits by the time I send it in for submission.  Is that what "dirty gmst's" are? I've been modding MW for... At least ten years? I guess I've never thought about it beyond cleaning a few mods in my mod packs with TESTool.

I might have to do the script for making locks unpickable for one door... Maybe two max. As far as levitation goes it's good to know it can be disabled in the area. I will consider the potential pros and cons of doing such a thing.  I think as long as I can make those two doors unpickable than levitaion wouldn't really break the dungeon, it'd just shorten it significantly. It's not very long currently and I'm trying to lengthen it a little bit (added another mini boss, new main boss, two new rooms). I think instead of worrying about length I should focus on quality though. I'd rather the player have a memorable and impressive, yet a little short experience than a long drawn out boring one.  If I end up having enough time I think to pad for content I will add some optional bosses in optional rooms. I'm using the static of the heart chamber for my main caves (along with about a billion giant boulders to make it look different) so there is plenty of space to add more rooms and such.

By the way, I just wanted to say it's an honor to be involved with this project and getting any sort of recognition. I knew many of the people involved in Modtown by their work for years and I'm very excited about this whole thing. Before this I've never built much more than small houses so even though my dungeon is short it's a huge leap in scale for me. Fortunately I have the help of my brother (also only ever built small houses) who is much more of an aesthetics person than I am. It's incredible (though no surprise) that this game has managed to keep such a passionate community for so long and I'm happy to finally contribute.

Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: HybridDisorder on February 01, 2016, 06:18:49 PM
Attached is the last sneak preview image of the project I'm going to release. This is a new area that hasn't been shown in any picture or video but I want to keep anything else a surprise. However note that I shrank the screenshot so I could attach it to this post, so it doesn't nearly as potato like in game.

Status report:

Statics 95-99%
Lighting 80%
Story 100%
Dialogue/story implementation 0%
Random details ?%
Hidden loot ?%
Hidden rooms ?%

I've decided to allow levitation, however a certain item that is along the main path will be the only way you can get through any of many different doors in the dungeon, including hidden ones. Effectively you'll be locked out of certain areas until you at least go get this item. That way people are free to fly around (and will probably be rewarded for their behavior) but I can control to some degree the order in which players can progress.
Title: Re: [Modder Claim] (No Plot) - HybridDisorder
Post by: Melchior Dahrk on February 01, 2016, 06:59:03 PM
Looking intriguing as usual, Hybrid! I'm very excited for this claim.